How to Retain Employees For 10+ Years with Alf Ruppert -
The majority of CEOs haven't been in the same company for over 15 years, but Alf Ruppert isn't the typical tech founder. "I'm somewhat closer to those who ran businesses in the 1950s," the founder acknowledges -- a period in which he felt that creating an enjoyable workplace was much more valued.
This perspective is why at least four employees have been part of the firm since it was founded.
In 2006, Alf was the founder of iOSXpert which is now the largest partner of the mac-based CRM and project management program Daylite. For the last 17 years, Alf is growing the company without any external funding and has maintained an impressive retention of its employees.
The former Director for Content and Community spoke to Alf about running a successful team, how he's grown the company with no external funds and the development history within the Mac community, and operating the business of consulting and software.
Stream the full interview below or whenever you are listening to podcasts.
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Transcript
Nathan Collier
Hello y'all. Thanks for joining me today. Hi. Hi. Introduce yourself and introduce iOSXpert to let people have a bit of a context about the work you perform.
Alf Ruppert
My name is Alf Ruppert, I was named like the guy that is famous for TV shows from the 90s or what the late 1980s looked like. Thanks God I was named earlier. The name I chose wasn't as cool kid at that moment. Yes, we, at iOSXpert, what are we doing? We are more or less a business consulting firm as a software consulting company that as there are several outside firms, we're a specialist in Apple users, helping Apple users. And this was the original idea that we came up with: iOS experts and meanwhile our company is increasingly more of a software companies. As we are making an enhancement for an CRM system that we sell. It's Canadian's CRM tool. It's well-known by Apple customers, and is referred to as Daylite and for this Daylite System, we are developing plugins, enhancements as well as additional services, and selling them around the globe. In addition, we have more than 120 countries.
Nathan Collier
And you are currently dialing from where in the world?
Alf Ruppert
We are located in Bendorf We are unaware of the tiny city that lies close to Koblenz. Koblenz is the place where the Rhine as well as the Moselle River are meeting. Furthermore, Koblenz is located between Frankfurt and Cologne.
Nathan Collier
Okay, so you're in Germany? Yes, yes. Okay, cool. You've been working on this company for a long time. So it looks like 2006. Does that sound right?
Alf Ruppert
In fact, I'm going searched for it in order to provide accurate answers the time.
Nathan Collier
Yes. Your LinkedIn says April 2006. That's right, however reason why I'm asking to know is because it's rare for me to bump upon someone working on one project for this many years. It's just that I'm intrigued because 2006 is like, this was long ahead of when iOS existed at all. Similar to the iPhone was released in 2008. Also, let me ask you a question what was the process that led to the project begin? In other words, how did start this project.
Alf Ruppert
So I always love to work on the Mac. My first and very first real job was in an enterprise back in the 90s, towards the end in the 90s. They were developing ERP software specifically for Mac users. This was a bit odd, because you had to promote it to everyone living in this day and age, as Mac was a cost of 10,000 German marks at the time. And while a PC was approximately four or 5000. This was quite amazing to make businesses using Mac devices, not only using them for a imaginative world, but also using them for real business properties. This is something I love very much. Then there was the huge ERP dying, which was shot after the first ecommerce new academy scene was going down for 2000 and 2001. And even at that the time, I was working for a business that was trying to create an ecommerce solution based on the Apple database. And we had to shut down too, and then I began to get my knowledge out and create something worthwhile with all that knowledge that I had about Macs as well as business-related things. And this is why I have a hard time describing that when I began my venture at the time, probably in 2004 or 5, I began. having a ton of free time because I just had to leave my job. It was a huge ERP going word was going to the ground in Germany. This is why I decided to put everything I knew online. It was the first site that I designed for myself. The reason I did this is a software known as rapidweaver that made me connect to the internet from the other side for myself. Then I put everything I had learned about business software on my Mac. From this came it's everything started when I began to search for a brand new product to sell and found Daylite and get in contact with the Canadian guys and I often say it was a really cool thing I made it out of the internet because it's not like I'm in that position today even though the time before the internet, it was before the internet that was a major change for me, because prior to it, it was indefinable when you're doing business with an Canadian company that has a way of getting in touch and establishing communication. that ends up in the first meeting. Then, you work on a project.
Nathan Collier
Yes, it was not that many years ago, but it was not that long ago as you're currently doing with me. I'm in the US and you're in Germany like this just didn't and this could have been an international , long distance call for about $3 per minute or something else paid to a telecom firm. It's interesting. Did you decide to upload all of your material online? This is 2014 classified right in there you, you in did you pick up consulting clients? Or was it was it straight to the software?
Alf Ruppert
It was just, I was required to have this niche knowledge about business workflow stuff and ERP systems and based on a Mac. Therefore, I wrote down everything, I knew in the event that I've got my own history just safe for me, then I can take a glance at it years later. It turned out to be people contacting me and say"Oh, you've got knowledge there, I did not know about it existed. The first person who can access all of this information in one location. And aside from that I try my best to locate a work care getting paid for what I do. To gain this understanding, and for working on the Mac while in my search for a job I discovered the CRM software and I was already always a product guy. So I need something I've been unable to get off of and sell it easily. This isn't the guy whom is told by salespeople. that I'm able to sell software, automobiles of the next day or what however, I must to fall in love with the thing I'm doing. Then I discovered something, that I loved, and it was Daylite due to its attractive way very much. Also, I was able to see the benefits for the customers. It slowly came out it was the first product that I had recommended as well to my customers who consult me, and then it was that product that I suggested to them. Okay, and started growth.
Nathan Collier
Then you began with consulting before you were then recommended this product and then eventually started building, building software to even make that product even better. This means you've been through across the entire spectrum of this particular software.
Alf Ruppert
Yes, it started because I'm aware that the initial piece of software we did to support Daylite was to connect for phone systems, so it was possible to press an icon and call out or if somebody's calling in, you can see which customers calling in. And the problem was, I don't know anything about the development of software. So I just had this concept. It was even a bit difficult to find funds to implement this. Then I came across an individual developer who made a deal with him, saying I'll buy it, and you will participate if you trust me. Then we worked in tandem. The result was an enormous success.
Nathan Collier
I can remember the time when this was happening because I was working for a company right around, you know, or 2010 around that time when that thing about making calls out on your personal computer linked to a CRM system was fairly new in the time of it all. Even the time the product had been available for sale. If you look back at 2006 2007 2008 like that, yeah, that was not something which people would do. Much like the way people do things today. Now we take it for granted now.
Alf Ruppert
Yes. It's the norm isn't working yet on Mac there are a few issues today due to the fact that with Windows PCs, the TAPI API. This means that operating systems have an internet connection for phones, something that the Mac isn't equipped with. And funnily enough, the very first iPhone had no such. Therefore, you couldn't utilize your iPhone using your Mac.
Nathan Collier
Yes, people do forget like, and it's difficult to recall, it's even the original iPhone that was launched with native applications without an app store it was for many years. So the iPhone that we have is not the iPhone in 2008, and the iPhone in 2008 was very groundbreaking. So very interesting. Did you think you would found this particular product Daylite? What is the risk in Daylite not being a sponsored partner, or you think. However, you are a fan of this product? Was there something in that particular product that caught your attention and led you to believe that this is fantastic, I'd like to do more with this.
The book has been unifying a number of aspects. This means that it's not only a travel book. It is just a calendar integrated and you can linking items together. It even grabs your email. It's a little an issue. When you view the tools that are standard on Mac even at a low-level then you can compare it with Outlook and Outlook. There's one app which has your address books, your calendar and emails. The problem is that it's not linked at all, however, it's only one app for a Mac that's as close to three applications. In fact, Daylite is exactly what it says. put all these together. Then, at the management of projects and opportunities for making estimates and selling stuff, all these are linked together and you only need one solution that Jaya changes, I think, as an expert in this area would say, this may have interested because of the idea of the 90s. In the beginning of 2000s, you have one solution that covers everything, right? In the meantime, the globe has changed. It is now awash with thousands of applications and tiny services. So even my concept of has changed in that manner that today, I would say there is a need for a central program, maybe like the digital hub. Think of how Steve Jobs mentioned the iMac. You've also connected things however you require a main application. And that's the idea of how we manage it. Today, we stay like we have Daylite as the primary reason that we have our enhancements. And a lot of the enhancements are relying on that which is why we have connected various platforms. That means we've got an online booking system called Acuity which we added to Daylite, which is the plugin we use. It was a good idea. Because if you have a clever integration of a couple of things, this will appear to the user that it's one application, but there are many applications and then it's easy to switch to make it better. Our work is fast. In a few years, we can find a better option for offering appointments online, and then we just have to connect this one. If you're able to stay using the same application, it will be that is customized.
Nathan Collier
I love that. It's this wonderful transition to so that last time in a couple of months, you we talked just very short about your thoughts about the business. You're probably beginning to understand a bit of it there. What are the most important like philosophies that you that you use to sort of guide your your business making decision-making, as again, 16 years, or however long years have passed, you've been working on this project. There are a lot of entrepreneurs, you know who build things, and they then sell the product and proceed to the next thing. They never don't appreciate that as an entire world of good which is great. In the same way, you can do that as a career. But you've chosen to sort of create one thing, and stick with it over the duration of. So what what what keeps you keen to this kind of issue? Also, what's the kind of principles you've applied in making business decisions throughout time.
That's why I've always been fascinated by. That's why there's one thing that led me to become an entrepreneur: I don't like all these policies that one has to face in large corporations. Therefore, I decided to create my created my own environment. And I love always doing my best to be part of the context of a group. And I think if you're at peace and comfortable at working, there's not much of a different between your work and your free time. In fact, I prefer working because it's not like I'm required to be there in the morning or anything similar to that. And it was very important for me to make an environment where everybody in my company feels exactly the same. So it was always important that I good care of my staff. And, and I think I've mentioned in an informal conversationthat maybe I'm little bit at this viewpoint, but I'm just a bit close to office managers or business owners back 1950s. Today,
Nathan Collier
what do you what do you mean by because you've said it several times? What do you mean by that?
Yeah. Therefore, I would like to show you an example we are in the process of establishing our office in the former Coca Cola building. In the 1950s, there was a pool right next to my office, where I sit, they had a swimming area for their employees. The company even considered creating something could benefit them and add worth to them and make them feel good. We can also take them to children to the area for swimming since there wasn't a swimming pool can no public swimming pool at that moment. That's why I say that I'd like to know if someone, there was a man recently in our community, who was a trainee here. The guy was originally from Kazakhstan but now he's grown up and has to make a trainee, sing in order to comply with German law and to get a new certification. So and then he ended with his car crashing, and he's really not the most money. So we bought the vehicle. Everybody who's here should be aware that when he faces problems we could solve, if it's sometimes it was money that was sometimes passed on if we move from one flight to another, and the whole team is there. That's what is the one we've got. It's probably what I'm the most proud of. I created that atmosphere that attitude here in the whole business with my team when I joined the team.
Nathan Collier
Did it happen that way? are going to be entrepreneurs out there that are thinking, that sounds awesome. How did you do it? Like? What was your experience with? What are some of the choices you took? Like? What? It's like, this is a fantastic example of a car. Also, what other things have you done over time that has kind been the catalyst for that kind of culture.
Alf Ruppert
Therefore, we must calculate, and this is even more so today. It's even more difficult today when we have to compensate for our talents. That's why, an issue for small companies such as ours, we are I believe that we're in the same boat as amoeba, 1670 people, it's, it's quite hard to compete with those who pay the least, as there are larger corporations that are able to pay more and to come try to make a mark on the price aspect. That's a tough thing. What we've done at the beginning, I think we do it now at least 15 yearslater, is that each year, we take a trip to the mountains with the whole team, all weekend long, as an one example. And we do some things like that, in the summer, or during summer time when we're trying to make it a bit easier to refer to them as friends, or maybe a little bit different thing that's not the sort of family that works, and my American North American partners often use the term work family. We also have people employed for long periods of time We have of people in the country who have been at least at the very beginning.
Nathan Collier
What would you say to the to the aspiring entrepreneurs for a moment. So for people who, who are thinking about they are a fan of your way of thinking and thinking about things, so build, build something, stay with it, make a space where people enjoy working, what tips would you give your colleagues? What are the best suggestions you have for people who'd like to build a company with that kind of culture?
Alf Ruppert
Yeah, there are a couple of things that could be first, quite easy one, try to be just a nice guy and honest. So not everyone is working for me , and I'm able to buy my 2nd Porsche. It's a mature drive. one . It was a mere picture. It was at the very starting point, when you can feel comfortable with people who will make overtures and really push hard to make to become an effective company. But do not forget them if you take the first steps, let them be part of the process. Thus, we are able to offer the two men since the first day, I gave them shares, and they also gave them shares as the company starts to be worth it. So they're even more into the company now that it's an integral part of their business. So, share your success, in the event that you can say only one thing, then yes, then trying to create it is a challenge since we are unable to offer no formula for doing that, but trying to to make a comfortable at-home environment that is comfortable for all employees. that that you are different from other organizations. Today where so many are in remote locations, their company culture is often getting confused. If you've got people which don't care how which kind of flag is in their house They're simply looking for they're sitting in the exact same place that they're in, working for Company A, or perhaps working for Company B then you reduce everything to cash, and try to not do something that it's by the money created by in the company's culture. an appropriate next step. to say that and I do not read as many books , because I've seen that there are a lot of people reading books and going to conference and asking themselves which is the best thing they could do. And I would say I have what one of the things I've learned from book was was write down your your company values. As an organization that we define the things that define us, and then we came across a couple of rules where we define our company values, we must be respectful, in a team and with respect, treat customers with respect and could we even expect similar from customers. Our time is to be as precious. Some things, but I did not write the details down, and then put them up whiteboard. Together we came up with them. What defines us as a firm? What is our scene where we want to be measured? Yeah,
Nathan Collier
I found that that's quite beneficial. The values are definitely helpful. I discovered that generally an reflection of your personality, which is different than the goals you have, and that is the place you'd like to like what you want to become. That's very interesting to know that you kind of got together and just described your identity, as well as what you are already that that then codified that your culture.
Alf Ruppert
And I use it every time I have job interviews I lay it out in front of them, and ask them to go through it and then think for yourself, you will fit in there. If you know where you stand with these core values, it's a fair possibility that you'll be a part of the group.
Nathan Collier
Right? What are you going to sort of like to get innovative ideas or fresh sources of inspiration? Are you looking at publications, conferences, or books? Like, what? What how does that look?
Alf Ruppert
I think the most of my inspiration comes from the time I get out of conversation with customers. I'm still, even as my work has changed. So because in the very initial beginning I was the only one doing all the things. So it was the consultant guy, the support guy, and as well, the sales guy. It's like, in the meantime I'm the one who has many people who claim that I'm the one who knows, at least about a particular topic at the workplace. I just have a good idea of what's happening in every department. However, I make sure to stay in direct conversation with customers. Therefore, I continue to conduct consulting sessions, even though they're not as frequent because my coworkers as well as me. I also continue to do sales personnel that remain in conversation with clients of all sizes. This means that I am able to know their requirements. Then I reflect on that and consider the guy is facing problems that we cannot solve until the solution is found to make his life easier his business life. Then the thought process, we can come up with some concepts. It's not that I love to run around all these trends. I have a funny story. I had a business friend. He was a huge supporter of and attended the SaaStr conference. And he said that you should go and have a look at the conference and one was in Europe and I thought, OK, let's visit there. Then we went together with three other persons. Then I attended this conference. And I was shocked because I thought I was running through a time tunnel to 2000. It was originally the same bullshit. When the first internet economy began. They were telling them I say I'm on the wrong part of the audience. If that's the case, I can be there to tell them, because I already seen what what these young guys were talking about. And I'm not sitting there and back again. the disabled ship was never lost. Everything was about how can create it appear larger and then sell it to receive the money for the next venture? Nobody had ever made any revenue of one centimeter. However, everyone were saying"Oh, that's great!. He also got another 20 million venture firm. What is the likelihood of success when you obtain venture funding? It's not a success if you design an item, sell it and you make money out of it?
Nathan Collier
Yeah. We were just director of product in the last, similar to Sastre Europe conference, is there, do you think there's a danger to go to an event like this, and, you know certain good things, and some terrible, and you get caught up in that sort of whole venture world where, where there are people who talk often about funding rounds and those kinds of stuff. But it sounds that you're more, and sure that's the case and I'd be happy for you to talk about it. It's more about developing a business which is profitable. It's clear that the same thing as 2006 up to now still still going. How do you feel about that is the threat from being too focused on those types of venture capital type ideas.
Alf Ruppert
This is a mistake I made, I already did this wrong in 1998 because I founded my first bigger firm, but it was not the internet-based stuff. This was exactly the same situation as it was prior to the economic crisis of 2001, everything crashed. Yeah. So yeah. Then we developed as a program and went with our last money to the C bid which was the most talked about thing at that time so for young people who watched this it was an important trade show all about computers and technology and was one of one of the biggest and most important in the world and it took place. It was held in Hanover and I can remember when he was the one who took our final money to rent the mobile home because we don't have money to pay to pay for the hostel where they'll say, If we do not find anyone who will pay us, we will be dead when we find out that somebody went to a guy who gave us money. And then they force us to follow this , that and the other. In fact, I was only a little when I was that age. I followed their instructions and get blown away. It was my understanding that at the time that it was somewhere between 5 and 600,000 years that I performed on scene German mouths. I don't remember that a long time. However, it was an amount of money to those of us back then. They also told us if the money is empty, just call us you can another round. Yeah, interesting. However, I called them in 2001, and they said oh, the money all the money has gone. Then, we had to close the company. Since I said, I will not take any cash any Venture people that are telling me how to proceed. I also told Bank that we had didn't need the bank. Everything we reached from from here until now, up to 1.151 point 5 million euros revenue is that we financed ourself interesting. In fact, I'm not even able to own a
Nathan Collier
Bootstrapped, in the true sense of the word. It's like since the beginning. What is one thing you'd like people to remember after listening to this interview?
Alf Ruppert
Avoid it, especially in the case of entrepreneurs. Don't let you ... be astonished to hear the nonsense they're telling you that they're selling an artist books and conferences for quick profits. It's better to construct something long lasting, which isn't to say that I'm in any way ... should someone would come around would say I'll pay you 30 million euros, I would reconsider my decision to sell it. This is a potential alternative aspect Don't worry if you choose the way that I prefer, as is, in my opinion, the more attractive way than trying to fast build something to sell it before it has earned the first dollar or euro of revenue. But on contrary, you shouldn't get too. If there's an opportunity at the end of the day, then it's best to sell than to let it go let it go. It's all about an equilibrium.
Nathan Collier
And you can do all that while operating at an income. Are you saying that?
Alf Ruppert
Yeah, yeah. It's not a success. If you of course we will inform that you're successful when you sold something for 20 million dollars, but what never made 1 million revenue which is why you need to make it a reality in your wallet. Yet, I'll be more satisfied if I build something where which which works as is as well as paying the employees of my company and earn a decent income for two families.
Nathan Collier
Yeah. Thanks, Alfred. Also, thanks Jeff. This has been a great experience. If you want people to kind of connect with you, how do they achieve that?
Alf Ruppert
Contact me on LinkedIn or just email me directly. All of my contact information at the site. I'm happy to share my experiences with entrepreneurs everywhere. It's true that leading to take a amount of time since I've learned 90% of and prepare for the questions you're putting to me because 90% of you attempt to sell me something at the start of maze I don't answer.
Nathan Collier
Maybe you can say Hey, I noticed that I saw your interview or heard your podcast or something as as the opening. Thank you, Alpha. We really appreciate your kindness.
Alf Ruppert
Yeah, you're welcome. Thank you very much.